Live from AIS 2022 in San Diego, CA

Dr. Grant Stevens

Hello everyone. Dr. Grant Stevens here in beautiful San Diego, California, home of AIS 2022, or the Aesthetic Innovation Summit. We're about to go in and listen to industry titans, clinicians and capital markets, movers and shakers. We're bringing all three together. This is the third time we've done this.

We did it in 2018, 2019, and now in 2022. It's our third time and it's a fantastic meeting. Come join us at the Technology of Beauty as we explore AIS, the Aesthetic Innovation Summit.

Disclaimer

Any statements or used expressed on this podcast are the opinion of the host and guests, respectively. The technologies and commercial products discussed herein and any claims made in relation to these have not been evaluated by the technology of beauty. Its host or producers.

Dr. Grant Stevens

Hello everyone and welcome back to the Technology of Beauty where I have the opportunity to interview the movers and shakers of the beauty business. And today is no exception. We are going to get to meet and know Carrie Caulkins from Galderma. Welcome, Carrie. Thank you so much. You're the VP of marketing for Galderma, is that right?

Carrie Caulkins

Yes, that's correct. For our aesthetics.

Dr. Grant Stevens

For the aesthetics business. So that's fantastic. Well, we've had a couple people from Galderma on the program and it's so great to have you. And you're presenting here at aesthetic Innovation Summit today, aren't you?

Carrie Caulkins

Yeah. I'm lucky to be in one of the panels, so it's a honor to be invited and get to share some of my thoughts about the industry with all of these other esteemed colleagues.

Dr. Grant Stevens

Fantastic. Tell us a little bit about yourself. Where'd you grow up?

Carrie Caulkins

So I grew up, for the most part in California. I actually moved around a ton when I was really young, but for the most part, California. I went to Brown for undergrad, so I'm a biomedical engineer in training in Heart. I went on to get my master's in PhD at UCLA.

So I missed the, missed the West Coast. And then I entered the business through a startup actually while I was. Finishing my dissertation I was actually working at a startup in Beatrix, which is developing a anti-aging skin serum. And I then quickly joined Allergan shortly thereafter.

Dr. Grant Stevens

When were you at Allergan? When did you start and finish there?

Carrie Caulkins

I started in 2005. I was there for 11 years.

Dr. Grant Stevens

Okay. So you were with David pt?

Carrie Caulkins

I was, I had the honor of working with Dr. Mr. Pie, I should say. Yes, and then I left Allergan after 11 years and I went to work for gal. So I had the opportunity to move to Sweden. I've been in Europe actually the last five and a half years driving their global product development strategy for aesthetics.

And then I recently moved back to the States to take this position stateside again for the marketing team.

Dr. Grant Stevens

Are you located in Texas now, or California?

Carrie Caulkins

I have, I, I now live in Plano, Texas. And we are actually moving our US headquarters to downtown. Fantastic. So very excited about that opportunity.

Dr. Grant Stevens

So the California gal gets educated in California after Brown and then to Europe and then back over and now in Texas. That's fantastic. Well, what can we expect from Galderma here over the next few years?

Carrie Caulkins

I think you can still expect a lot. I mean, we have been doing some amazing things in this space.

Really grabbing market share. A lot through our great pipeline. So we've, we've had, multiple launches over the past couple years. You're gonna continue to see a lot more innovation come from us as well as just, again, our strong focus on service and partnership with all of our customers.

Dr. Grant Stevens

When you say innovation from you, are you. Innovating from within or are you purchasing like M&A deals and so forth?

Carrie Caulkins

It's a little bit of both now, which is great. I would say, originally we were definitely more focused on organic growth, so internal development. But as you can see with this last year we've had several, several acquisitions.

So one of them, Ming Elastin. Which is a really great. Which we love. As well as we, we've did a partnership with software, so a new Biostimulatory technology. And we're continuing to look at other opportunities as well.

Dr. Grant Stevens

That's fantastic. Well, it's so great to have you here on the show and at the AIS and we look forward to getting to know you better in the years to come in the aesthetic space.

Carrie Caulkins

I really appreciate it. I think it's a, it's a great space to be. I love this space and I just, it's just such a privilege to work with people like you, so thank you.

Dr. Grant Stevens

That's fantastic. Thank you very much. Thank you. And take care, Karen.

Hello everyone and welcome back to the Technology of Beauty where I have the opportunity to interview the movers and shakers of the beauty business. And guess what? Today is no exception. We have a special guest, Jordan Schindler, who just presented here at AIS. Amazing technology that you're gonna hear about right now that I have never heard about until just moments ago.

Welcome. Thank you for being here. Thanks for having me on. I appreciate it. It's an absolute honor and I look forward to hearing more about this technology. Tell us a little bit about it.

Jordan Schindler

Absolutely. So our core technology enables control delivery of vitamins, supplements, medications, through your clothing, and that's effective through 15 plus wash cycle.

We all, every single day get dressed. Why not use that as a platform for delivery of active ingredients through your skin? So it might be a line of topical analgesics like we see here. So Icy Hot or Biofreeze in a sock, a knee sleeve, a back race. We have a line of maternity garments, so think about belly bands, leggings, shape wear with shea butter for your skin.

Or it might even be as far afield as melatonin in a pillowcase to help you fall asleep at night. That's this category of health wear that we've created.

Dr. Grant Stevens

When I put this garment on or something, do I feel this stuff? Is it sticky or gooey?

Jordan Schindler

That's the coolest part about the technology, is it feels, looks and performs like a normal garment.

So it stretches, it wicks away moisture. It's comfortable. You don't actually feel like you're rubbing a cream on your body, which is really the whole value proposition.

Dr. Grant Stevens

So if I have a sore arm or a sore knee or ankle, you have a garment that'll help me.

Jordan Schindler

You know it. You know it. One, one of the biggest challenges today is patient compliance.

We're all increasingly busy. We forget to take pills or use creams or patch. But we all get dressed every single morning. Why not use clothing as that platform for solving health and wellness outcomes?

Dr. Grant Stevens

So if I put your garment on, I can wear it for 15 days, would you? 15 washes.

Jordan Schindler

15 washes, exactly. And you're getting the exact same dose you would get using a therapeutic topical cream or pill.

Dr. Grant Stevens

Even oral, a pill?

Jordan Schindler

Exactly. It's the same equivalency. Exactly right. Depending on the active ingredient. So we actually have our own transdermal drug delivery lab where we've run comparison studies between a garment, a patch, and a cream.

And because you have that constant skin contact, you actually get a better dose of medication.

Dr. Grant Stevens

So tell us a little bit about yourself. How'd you get involved in this and where are you from? What's this is so novel.

Jordan Schindler

Yeah, so I grew up in Arizona on the west coast, went to school out in Seattle and suffered from bad skin in college.

And learn about the link between your pillowcase and bad skin. And so as you sleep, dirt and oil builds up, c clogging your pores and ultimately went to the dermatologist and was recommended to wash my pillowcase two to three times per week. Which as you can imagine, as a college-aged male, not chance was not gonna happen.

It where where 10 years later, still not gonna happen. But that's what got me thinking about how do you create a benefit from a garment or fabric, something that contacts your skin all day, every. And so teamed up with some MIT PhD, drug delivery scientist. Got some early funding actually at a Department of Defense, and that's actually what sparked this technology development.

Dr. Grant Stevens

Very fascinating. This is terrific. Well, welcome to the AIS s, the Aesthetic Innovation Summit. It's so great to have you. It's so innovative. I hope you stay around for this aesthetic meeting. I'd like to introduce you to anyone that will listen. This, this is really exciting. Oh, so as a delivery drug delivery system.

Anything to deliver anything transcutaneous while I'm just wearing your garment. And why don't you share everybody what you have.

Jordan Schindler

Yeah, we brought one of our, our products. It's a foot ankle sleeve. It's got capsaicin, a topical analgesic built into it. You can buy these today at cvs. Target, Walgreens, Walmart.

Along with a number of other products, but very excited to be here. Incredible event. Some, some great people. So I appreciate you having me.

Dr. Grant Stevens

It's my pleasure. Where's your home base now?

Jordan Schindler

So we're based in Charlotte, North Carolina, in the heart of, of textile manufacturing. So we're really at the intersection of drug delivery and textiles.

Dr. Grant Stevens

I love it. The intersection of drugs and textiles.

Jordan Schindler

And, and you think about 700 billion of pharma revenue and marry that with 70 billion of, of textile revenue. And new fabrics is that platform that can facilit. Nike Sock with icy hot blue lemon garments with moisturizer, and we create that platform.

Dr. Grant Stevens

Fantastic. Well, I love it. Although I have one final question. Are you a Husky?

Jordan Schindler

I am. You know it.

Dr. Grant Stevens

Well, that's a problem.

Jordan Schindler

We got the W.

Dr. Grant Stevens

That's a problem because I'm a duck. Go Ducks.

Jordan Schindler

Oh no. Oh, no.

Dr. Grant Stevens

Good having you. You take care.

Hello everyone and welcome back to the Technology of Beauty where I have the opportunity to interview the movers and shakers of the beauty business and folks. Today is no exception. We've got Dr. Steve Diane, and we are here in beautiful San Diego at AIS 22, which is the Aesthetic Innovation Summit 2022.

Welcome, Steve. It's great to be here. It's so great to have you here. Now I have to tell you a few things. First of all, full disclosure, we've been accused of. Twin brothers, different mothers. Steve just came off of the stage where he gave, without a doubt, the finest talk I've ever heard predicting the future.

He gave us 10 points to look for. There's no way we can encapsulate into this brief interview, but I'm telling you, if you're not following Steve, Diane, you are not following aesthetics. So thank you Steve, for joining us. Let's start with this. Talk about the technologies. Tell us a little bit about yourself.

We'd like to get to know you. Where are you from?

Dr. Steven Dayan

Well I'm, I will definitely get into this, but this is reminding me like Roy Firestone. Are you gonna make me cry?

Dr. Grant Stevens

No, I'm not gonna make you cry.

Dr. Steven Dayan

I've been wanting to be on the show for so long. I finally got on here and now I feel like I made it cause I just saw you interviewing Brent Saunders.

And now I get to come up on here. So thank you for having me. And I don't know, I'm just a simple guy. I like to barbecue on the weekends.

Yeah.

Dr. Grant Stevens

Long walks on the beach.

Dr. Steven Dayan

Take my dog I'm facial plastics from Chicago and Right. And I've been doing that for, I don't know, for 20 years, but I, I dabble in a lot of other things.

I'm a, I'm a creative, innovative person. I have a appetite that's hard to satiate when it comes to new and.

Dr. Grant Stevens

You sure do. Where'd you grow up?

Dr. Steven Dayan

I grew up, well, I was well born and raised in Chicago all around. My dad's an immigrant from Morocco, so I still have a lot of that. And my mom, unfortunately was disabled with ms, so I raised a lot of myself running around Chicago area for my youth.

And I was, I was a horrible student. No one ever gets that. But I was actually a C student in high school and when I applied to college, I couldn't get in. I got rejected from all my state schools. I go to my father and. I didn't wanna tell him that I didn't get into college cause he's like, you're gonna be a doctor cuz I was a son of an immigrant.

Every immigrant son is gonna be a doctor and I have the heart to. Well then Wash U and St. Louis came and said, you wanna play football? Cause I was a football player and I wasn't the kicker, I was actually a receiver. But everyone thinks I was a kicker. No, I was the rece. I was a receiver. And they asked me if I wanted to play football.

And I said, and they let me into the school. So I got into the school based on football and then I quickly realized my dreams of being an NFL Pro player was not gonna happen. Right? So I gave it up for school. I started studying and studying and I ended up doing really well and the rest is history.

Dr. Grant Stevens

That's fantastic. And you went. To then become a doctor and then otolaryngologist and then facial plastics. And your practice is in Chicago? Right. Tell us a little bit about your podcast.

Dr. Steven Dayan

Well so right now Sabrina Fabi, who's my lovely fiance, is dermatologist here in San Diego. Her and I together run a program during Covid.

Like everyone else, we didn't know what was gonna happen, so we were trying to think of other things to do. So we created a training program cuz we both liked to teach and we started doing virtual training programs and. That has just exploded. And it's virtual education, which we do CME education all around the country.

And now we started taking it outside the US to other countries where we're in five continents. And what we've done is, what's really unique is we've taken, we've taken medical education and reality TV and we've brought it together. So it's fun if you watch it. Like we have people, someone told me last week they were binge watching our programs cause they're up online.

You binge. Who binge watches cme. So we're having a lot of fun with it. Now. We have a film crew following us around and we're documenting the whole series, so stay tuned. Maybe one of these days we'll put it up on YouTube.

Dr. Grant Stevens

That's fantastic. Yeah. It's a lot of fun. I watch it. It's fantastic.

Dr. Steven Dayan

Now it's called Thriving and Aesthetics.

Thriving aesthetics.com.

Dr. Grant Stevens

Yeah. It's all over Instagram and every thriving aesthetics. Now you made 10 bold predictions about this year. We're not gonna go through all 10. What I'd like to hear from you is what do you think the most exciting areas are right now in aesthetics here and now, and maybe even over the next five years?

What's really got your attention?

Dr. Steven Dayan

So there's a lot that has my attention and here at AIS, I cannot believe how much me, fantastic presentations I've seen on a lot that piques my. Seen great devices that can do things that none of the devices out there do. But I have to say, regenerative medicine clearly is something that we're all circling around and trying to get our hands around it and exosomes what's, what's the future of that?

Are we gonna be injecting them? Are we doing topical? And so I think that's hard. Not to say that that's one of the key, probably fastest growing, innovative technologies and excitement coming to the market. So I'm excited about that. And I think the second thing that we really haven't touched on so much, That's coming.

And I meant, I mean, I put this as my 10th prediction is virtual reality in the metaverse. I mean it's coming faster than we realize. And it could be our avatars that are talking three or four years from now and not us, and what does that mean for aesthetics? So I think that that's interesting too.

Dr. Grant Stevens

Will we be operating. Operating on our avatars, so let's, as opposed to our reality,

Dr. Steven Dayan

you know they can have marina man land. There you go. Space on there. And you might be selling marina nose jobs online, you know? And who knows?

Dr. Grant Stevens

Yeah. It's, it's crazy. It's really crazy. So no question about it.

Well, thank you for sharing your time with us here at AIS and I look forward to the afternoon and hanging with you and give my regards to, Thank you once again. Look forward to seeing you soon.

Dr. Steven Dayan

Grant, always a pleasure. Thanks for having me. Absolutely.

Dr. Grant Stevens

Thank you, Steve.

Welcome back to the Technology of Beauty where I have the opportunity to interview the movers and shakers of the beauty business, and today is no exception. I get to interview my great dear friend, Mr. Dennis Condon. Now, Dennis has been on the program once before, but it was remote and today he's right here in front of me and you're getting it to know him.

He's been a friend of mine for. Almost 40 years. Wow. In fact, he takes credit for any successes that I have, which you may hear about. We're here at the AIS Aesthetic Innovation Summit 2022 in San Diego, California. Welcome, Dennis. Thank you, grant. Thank you very much. It's so great to have you. Nice to be in person with you.

Yes. No kidding. How you liking the a AIS s meeting so far?

Dennis Condon

It's great. The diversity of the different topics and so forth from pharmaceuticals to devices, et cetera, is fantastic. It's a, it's a nice learning experience all packed into a single day.

Dr. Grant Stevens

And what about being around people live and not on a Zoom call?

Dennis Condon

Well, that goes without saying. I mean, I, I. I started off in marketing. I like being with people, sales and marketing, and the last few years has just been so difficult. I mean, the Zoom, I sit at my office at home on Zoom and I wonder what am I doing? It is, it is very hard. You can't really read people as much.

You can't really tell exactly what the response is, so it's very nice to be back in person.

Dr. Grant Stevens

Yeah, I'll say, It's so great and this meeting, it's great. After two years of being down. We did it in 18 and 19. And then we were closed down for 2021. So it's, it's great to be back and seeing all of our friends from industry.

Dennis Condon

Well, the aesthetic meeting, the later this week, is that gonna be the first time I've been in two years to a larger, and I'm used to going to between boards and companies.

I go to anywhere between seven and eight different meetings a year. And it's been two years without a major meeting. Very, very different.

Dr. Grant Stevens

I can relate. I think the last meeting you went to was in new Orleans. When I was the outgoing president, I led the parade through the streets.

Dennis Condon

That was probably it. And you were in full costume?

Dr. Grant Stevens

Yes, I was. And I had the time of my life. So let's talk about you, your company. And also we just heard Pat Alta, your ceo, talk about some exciting things in the future. So tell us a little bit about where we're at, where we are now, and more importantly where you're going.

Dennis Condon

Yeah, I, I've had a, a, a phenomenal career.

An enjoyable career in aesthetics. I've had an opportunity lead companies in skincare and injectables and lasers and implants. And so for me, this whole field of regenerative esthetics is like a. Pillar of aesthetics, which is fantastic. So given that I've had the opportunity, I'm on the board of Establishment Labs where we see autologous fat being used in breast aesthetics as well.

And then with cva, we're more in facial aesthetics and we've, we've put together, when I first came there three and a half years ago, we had a single product. Today we have seven technologies, most of them evolving around regenerative aesthetics. It. Fascinating. It is fun to see. It's a, it's an emerging field.

And as a company right now, Seva has probably the broadest array of re regenerative technologies and looking for more. Looking for more. So it's, it's, and where are you based? We are based in San Diego, California. So right here. Right here. It's home for us.

Dr. Grant Stevens

And do you have an appetite for acquisitions?

Dennis Condon

We absolutely do. We're in the middle of doing a, a. Transaction right now, which would give us a significant amount of money on the balance sheet, and we'll be looking for additional acquisitions, primarily based in the regenerative aesthetics field. That's where we really want to be, and we'd like to become, the sort of the broadest based company of regenerative aesthetics.

Dr. Grant Stevens

Would you entertain thoughts of device or plug-in play, or is it all topical?

Dennis Condon

It, it's interesting there. I think that when I talk about the four areas that I've been in, I think every one of those areas can marry up with regenerative treatments eventually. So that, Regenerative won't be sort of a standalone business any longer.

It'll be, you may be using in healing for lasers, may be using p r p. It may be in stamping needle technology may be using stromal vascular fractions. So there the field is endless, which makes it so much fun. Absolutely. Absolut mean. I, I thought I'd retire three or four years ago. Not a chance.

Dr. Grant Stevens

You can't retire, Dennis. Well, listen, I want to thank you so much for joining us on this. I appreciate. As you can hear, they're calling us back into the program.

Dennis Condon

Well, thank you for the opportunity.

Dr. Grant Stevens

Good seeing you. Yeah, great seeing you too. You take care, Dennis. Take care.

Thanks now.

Hello everyone and welcome back to the Technology of Beauty where I have the opportunity to interview the movers and shakers of the beauty business. And today is no exception. I have the opportunity to interview my dear friend, bill Murray. Thank you for coming. Bill Grant, good to be here. Now before we get going with the interview, I want to set the stage.

We're here at AIS 2022 in San Diego, California. This is clearly not the studio for technology of beauty. So we're here because I had to go looking for Mr. Meury. I've invited him to the studio multiple times, but he's so busy. He's so huge. I finally tracked him down here at AIS. And he's gonna be speaking a little bit later.

Thank you very much, Bill, for joining us.

William Meury

Of course, you need to, you need to create a New York City studio so that you have one on the East coast and the West coast.

Dr. Grant Stevens

You're right. I need to do that. I'll take that as a challenge and I'll, that's what we'll do, Max, Adam, we're gonna open up a studio in New York.

You hear that guys? So I first got to know you when you were running Allergan. Yes, you know you and Brandon had come over from activist. Purchased Allergan. I think it was about 2015. And you ran it for five years. And I had the privilege Yeah.

To work with you alongside you, and we had a, a blast. Oh, it was a great time. Yeah, no question. Then you sold it to Brent, I mean, sorry, you sold it to AbbVie. I haven't seen you for a while, and I want to know where have you been? Sure. What are you doing? And where are you going? So, in that order.

William Meury

Right, right now I'm at a New York City based private equity firm called Hilary Capital.

We make investments in healthcare companies, products and services. We have about 17 portfolio companies. And I work there as a partner. We have a couple portfolio companies that are doing work in the skincare and aesthetic space. Brent asked me to be on this panel at the end of the day, and, and I've spoken to you.

And so that's what I'm doing for right now. I'm watching very carefully how well the, the aesthetics team is doing inside of AbbVie, and it looks like they're posting great.

Dr. Grant Stevens

Yeah. They are. And you and I were talking earlier today about the effect that Covid had initially on the economy, the aesthetic economy.

And we saw this turn downturn because no one could get into the office. And then lo and behold, As soon as people start coming in, it just skyrocketed. Tell us a little bit about your thinking along those lines.

William Meury

Yeah, look, I I, there are very few industries or sectors that are quote, recession proof.

But I think aesthetics is about as close as it gets and, whether you go back to the Great Depression or the recession. Or, or the pandemic. It's proven to be an incredibly resilient business, and I think the credit goes to the providers. And while the manufacturers have great products, ultimately the success of aesthetics is based on the specialists who are administering the procedures.

And I know in 2020, I think March and April were the worst months. And by the time we hit the summer of 2020, Demand for aesthetic procedure started to climb. And it looked like, if you look at the curve, it was literally a V-shaped revenue curve. And I think there were a lot of people that questioned whether it would happen.

But time and time again, you see just how resilient this business is. And now it's probably growing at a faster rate than it's grown at in several years. And based on my. The market will probably double between now and, and 20 25, 20 26. I mean, it's growing at a 10 to 15% clip. I don't see any reason why that would change.

Dr. Grant Stevens

So did you hear that? He predicted up to a 15% growth per year? That would be a doubling time in five years for those of you. And I agree with you. And a lot of people were worried that it was just a. Backlog of cases or storage of cases and the, it was pen up demand, and then it would peter out. Yeah.

But that's not what we saw.

William Meury

No, not at all. I mean, look, attitudes and perceptions towards aesthetics have continued to evolve in the most positive way possible. The products, the procedures, the technologies that are available today are better than before. And then the outcomes that plastic surgeons and other aesthetic specialists are producing.

Are really, really high. And it's just, it's driving demand. I mean, you and I were talking earlier this morning based on certain surveys. There's a procedure, an aesthetics procedure done every second in the Absolutely. In the United States. And there are 31 million seconds.

Dr. Grant Stevens

and we were estimating at least 30 million up to 50 million perhaps procedures per year.

William Meury

That's exactly right. And, and if you look at, I think you. Allergan has published this information as well as all the plastic surgeon societies. The number of people who are receiving aesthetic procedures is probably broadly speaking, between five and maybe 10 million. But the number of. People considering is broadly speaking between 15 a hundred million.

And so there's a long way to go here. And the prospects for the industry are exceptional. And providers are better trained than ever before. Indeed. And so, it's as an, as a, as an investor right now, not an operator. It's like having beachfront real estate. That never goes down. It never go.

It shouldn't go down in value. I think it's, listen, if you're part of the aesthetics industry, whether you're a provider or you're a manufacturer, you're in a really good spot. I would agree.

Dr. Grant Stevens

And it's also the average ages coming down. Do you wanna address that a little bit?

William Meury

Yeah. I mean, look, there was a millennial movement underway back in 2014.

I think if I remember the data correctly, there were less than 300,000 millennials receiving an. Procedure back then. Today that number's about one and a half million. And then of course, if you layer in. Gen Y and Gen Z. The future of the industry looks exceptional. People are unapologetic about it, getting aesthetic procedures.

It's no different than diet and exercise. And minimally invasive procedures have become a gateway. For aesthetics, consumers, and then they graduate to, to more serious procedures if they, if they want to. And again, at the end of the day, I think that the success and the health of this industry is in the hands of the specialists doing the procedures and in my experience, Satisfaction rates when someone goes to an aesthetic practice that is professionally run are extraordinarily high.

Yes. And that's why everyone is benefiting from the growth in aesthetics.

Dr. Grant Stevens

I would agree. Well, it's been great getting caught up with you a little bit. I look forward to spending more time with you when you're back out in la. Absolutely. Or when I build my new studio in New York, of course. Great.

Thank you very much for coming.

William Meury

Thanks Grant.

Dr. Grant Stevens

You take care. Bill.

Hello everyone and welcome back to the Technology of Beauty where I have the opportunity to interview the movers and shakers of the beauty business. And today is no exception. Today we have the opportunity to interview and get to know better, even better. Alisa Lask, Alisa, you may know from Galderma, but now she's at Rion.

Alisa Lask

I am. Thanks for having me.

Dr. Grant Stevens

Thank you very much for joining us.

Alisa Lask

It's great to be in California with you.

Dr. Grant Stevens

Yes, it's great. So what she's referring to is we are sitting here in San Diego, California at the 2022 AIS meeting Aesthetic Innovation Summit, and Alyssa and I are co-chairs of this exciting meeting and she has volunteered or agreed to be here for an interview.

So tell us about Rion.

Alisa Lask

Absolutely. So Rion is a regenerative medicine company, so it was founded a few years ago based on about 15 years of research at the Mayo Clinic, and it's based on exosome. So what the discovery was, the breakthrough was really that it's not stem cells that do regeneration. It's these little things called exosomes that send signals to your cells and tell them what to do.

Dr. Grant Stevens

Okay, so she said regenerative medicine. I'm gonna ask her to define that, and then I'm gonna ask her to define exosome. So let's start with gen regenerative medicine, for those who don't know what the heck that means.

Alisa Lask

Yeah. Listen, I've worked in pharmaceuticals my whole career. And we've spent years telling people to put chemicals into their body.

Then we've talked about plant derive things, and for now we're talking about human derived ingredients. So regenerative medicine is actually using the body to heal from within. I mean, the most powerful thing to heal is really your.

Dr. Grant Stevens

Okay. And what is an exosome?

Alisa Lask

Great question. So exosomes are what actually signal your cells to do healing.

And there's a special exosome that we call regen zone, and that's the exosome that signals soft tissue healing. So the first thing that happens when you start bleeding, your platelets are responding to the injury and telling their your cells and they need to heal. And so our technology is based off of platelets.

Dr. Grant Stevens

So do the exosomes come from the platelets? It does. It's platelets arrived. Now, how do you get them into my body? Or are they, do you put 'em as a shot? Iv. Im subq. Transdermal. How do you put those exosomes in my body?

Alisa Lask

So it's a platform technology. We actually have studies going on. It started in the heart.

So. Studies in the heart. We have studies in wound, that's our flagship. And then for aesthetics, the one I'm most excited about, we actually have a cosmetic line. So we are launching skincare as well as scalp health. And then long term we'll have products that'll be injectable for hair, maybe injectable for wrinkles in the future.

I think the nice thing about a platform technology is there's so much.

Dr. Grant Stevens

Okay. So right now the aesthetic product is, is a topical product like a skin, like a lotion or potion? Absolutely. Absolutely. And how big are these molecules and how do they get through the skin?

Alisa Lask

So they're actually very, very small and they're able to penetrate the skin.

Our initial studies, we actually can see the exosomes on the collagen, so we know that they're penetrating.

Dr. Grant Stevens

Do you label them or? How do you see them? I'm curious. Well, there's all, are they little guys? Hi, I'm an exosome. I'm over here on the

Alisa Lask

collegen.

Yeah, exactly. There's all kinds of science behind that, and that's probably for another day.

We've got a lot of publications coming out, so I guess we can see on the publications.

Dr. Grant Stevens

Well, it's really exciting, that's for sure. Let me ask you something else. You mentioned the heart. Are you using exosomes as a company? I know we're talking about aesthetic right now. Yep. But, and, and it's helping the heart heal after a heart attack or something like that?

Alisa Lask

Well, we're still in early studies looking at safety, but I think our hope is that we're gonna improve outcomes for those patients that maybe wait till the end of the football game after they have the heart attack to come in. Oh my goodness. And really improve those. So we're recruiting patients right now.

And we should finish up our phase one data this year.

Dr. Grant Stevens

It is super exciting. Whole field of regenerative medicine and particular exosomes. Thank you very much for sharing your. You've gotta come back and stay on the the long, long version show. Absolutely. I know you've gotta get outta here. Thanks for co-chairing also.

Alisa Lask

Thank you for having me.

Dr. Grant Stevens

It's such a pleasure. Thank you. Bye bye.

Hello everyone and welcome back to the Technology of Beauty where I have the opportunity to interview the movers and shakers of the beauty business. And today is no exception. Today we have the opportunity to get to know even better. Mr. Aaron Burton, the CEO of Sciton. Thank you Aaron for joining us.

Aaron Burton

It's good to see you, man. A mover and a shaker. I like that.

Dr. Grant Stevens

A mover and a shaker and a leader in the aesthetics business. I appreciate it. But before we interview Aaron I'd like to set the stage. We're here in San Diego, California. We're not in Manhattan Beach, where our studio. We're here in San Diego and we're attending the AIS meeting, our Aesthetic Innovation Summit, and Aaron's gonna be presenting and the Sciton Company is here, and I always call it the Bentley of Lasers.

Aaron Burton

We love that quote. We use it all the time.

Dr. Grant Stevens

Yeah, it's, it's actually without a doubt, hand built, hand stitched in the very best laser on the market bar. And I'm not paid to say that, so, but you can keep saying. Aaron, what's up? I know there's been some recent advances. I have 'em in my office. I'll let you talk about 'em.

You know what's up. I haven't talked to you for a while.

Aaron Burton

Well, you know the big ones. I don't think it. I mean, it must have been about two years since we had did this last. Yeah, it's been, has about two years. It has to be BBL L, hero. There you go. Heroes.

Dr. Grant Stevens

He said BBL Hero. And when I first heard Hero, I thought it was just being cutesy. And then I heard it's an acronym. What's it stand for?

Aaron Burton

High Energy Rapid Output. Our marketing crew's pretty impressive. I was like, wow, that is a cool name.

Dr. Grant Stevens

They do a great job. High energy, rapid output, for those of you who are used to I P L or the proprietary bbl, you know that we typically stamp the energy, the light, if you will. We've never been able to have a roller or consistent application. Tell us about Hero and what you have now that nobody has.

Aaron Burton

Yeah. The beauty of Hero is obviously it's emotion treatment. So when you think of I P L or you think of our bbl L, you're thinking of generally one, you're thinking of facial treatments and you're thinking of a stamping approach.

BBL L Hero is a motion treatment, so one. Significantly faster. You're able to do it all over the body and you're able to do a body treatment relatively quick, not relatively quick or very quick. You have less complications. I mean, I think when you start doing the chest and the arms, when you do the arms, the chest, the back, the legs, you're worried about striping and burn marks.

And so usually people are hands off. They're not, they'll, they'll, they love doing the face with an I P L or a BBL l but when you start doing the shoulders or someone says, I want you to treat my chest. They're, hands off, I'm not gonna go do that. That's the beauty of hero. Hero is anywhere on the.

Full body and everybody's talking body these days, there's a lot of body contouring, but people who want their body to look good also want their skin on their body to look good too. So being able to say, I can do someone's shoulders or arms or do, do someone's, chest or, full body is, it's, it's been, it's been bbl L has always been a great product for us.

BBL Hero is another level.

Dr. Grant Stevens

It's crushing it. Now I want to emphasize that. So it's much faster. So how long do you quote average arm treatment for Dyschromia?

Aaron Burton

I'm not sure. I'm the one to give you quotes on time, but 45 seconds. I mean, it's, it's gonna, you can do it like a full body in three.

Dr. Grant Stevens

So those of you practitioners out there, when we're numbing up the face and preparation for another procedure, we can literally do both arms easily with the B B L.

I'm not being paid to say this. It's completely revolutionized our approach to using BBL l technology. And that stamping leads to striping and leads to all sorts of things. So we tend not to do the back and the arms. Nobody wants to do that. So everybody, because we've all had it. Even as, as, as conscientious as we are, as careful as we are, we all see the stamping.

Yeah. With that roller technology, we've, we've eliminated. It's much more efficient. It does a terrific job.

Aaron Burton

And we've been hear, we've been hearing that feedback for years, but we've been working on how do we fix it. I mean, providers have been saying, Hey, if there's something you could do, I'd like to do more treatments on the body.

That's one of our advantages is, I mean, we're a true r d house. I mean, that's, that is one of the, I mean, Hobart and NIGOs, I mean, they're physicists and they're still hands on smack in the middle of the game, and it's pretty amazing. And you give them a challenge, they'll figure it out. Now. It took 'em, they were working on that for six or seven years.

We were working on that for a long time.

Dr. Grant Stevens

Well, congratulations to the company and Hobart and the whole group because totally revolutionary. Now I imagine you have locked it up and it's your proprietary technology Of course. And no one else has it.

Aaron Burton

Well, there's two ways we look at it. There's the IP piece of it.

Then there's also, how do you come up with technology that just outpaces everybody else? Hobart and the R&D team, they're always looking for what's next? What's next?

Dr. Grant Stevens

Okay, that's a great intro. What. Is new since the last couple years when I had you on the program.

Aaron Burton

I guess the other big one's, probably Moxie.

Which is our 1927 non-ablative. So Halo has always been our our go-to since 2015 for the less aggressive, we're known for burning your face off. You have an amazing result at the end cuz you do full fielder and resurfacing, but most people don't wanna do that. So then we came out with Halo.

And Halo, is this really home run? More aggressive treatment but less downtime. You know that one. And then Moxie's even a step. I mean, it's, you're back in the game. Little bit of, discomfort or heat during the treatment, but you're going right back to work. You get, I mean, you look basically rosy or look like you have, you know little, you're out in the sun a little bit, but there's not a lot of downtime.

Not a lot of discomfort. And it's one of those, you, it's almost like you do a halo once a year. Do a moxie two or three times a year, and somewhere in there you're mixing in your BBL hero.

Dr. Grant Stevens

That's a lot to absorb for those of you who aren't in the laser business

Aaron Burton

You explain that, you should explain that.

Dr. Grant Stevens

1927 refers to nanometers, and this is the moxie, it's sort of the junior laser, if you will, and he mentioned two or three times a year. It's sort of an intro, put your toe in the water laser. I'm a huge fan, fan of the halo. Yeah, I still think the halo is, yeah, you're getting 'em. Yeah, I, I know I had mine about four weeks ago.

I think I had mine about four weeks ago too. I saw that on social media. I still think you mix a halo with now a hero or a bbl. That's what I did on the face. It's absolute home run for dyschromias, for skin tightening, for smoothing for so much. Also, full, full disclosure, I had a contour under my eyes. Why don't you tell us about contour.

Aaron Burton

Yeah, so Contour's old school, that was one of our original products re-roll out 25 years ago. And when we're talking to people, it's just, it's funny talking to 'em about what original product from 1997 we still sell today, and plastic surgeons buy it all the time. So it's full, it's full field resurfacing.

Right. So it's full field ablation, ium ablation, and it's tuneable. So you can do a hundred microns, you can go almost as deep as you want, as depending on how many passes you wanna. So it's usually a plastic surgeon's gonna use that. You're not seeing your dermatologist and your red spas that are gonna do.

Dr. Grant Stevens

And there are times we have deep wrinkles on the upper lip.

Yeah. Lipstick or lipstick bleed lines and some people call 'em smoker's. Wrinkles. And also around the periocular area. And I haven't had a full surface full field fully ablative before. But I was glad I did and it tightened and smooth.

Aaron Burton

So I've had a micro laser peel, which is the, 50 microns.

So it's almost just that's like blowing on the skin's but I've never had a, I haven't had one of the deep ones yet either, but I'm sure someday I will. And, but I think the more halos and the more moxies and the more BBL heroes you do, the less of that you do.

Dr. Grant Stevens

That's right. And, can you give us a look into your crystal ball?

What, what's the future for Sciton? Is there anything you can share with this audience?

Aaron Burton

Yeah, good question. I know you had asked me that. I would actually, I would, I couldn't give you, obviously I can't be specific, but I would tell you a lot more the same, whereas we're always looking at innovative new ways of doing things.

I think there's, if you look at our R&D pipeline, which I know you want to talk about, we can talk more later, but R&D pipeline, there's blue ocean stuff. That I think will be very different for the industry. And then I think there's stuff where you've got the hero, which is people are saying, if you could do this a little bit better, and our R&D group is bigger than it's ever been.

We're spending more money on R&D than we've ever spent. Both as a percentage and, and as a total dollar amount. But we're, that's, that's who we are. I mean, we'll, we'll always be an RD company that focuses on that stuff. And so I guess the, the quick answer would be a lot more of the same. A lot of the same. I mean, we're always finding new products and new innovations.

Dr. Grant Stevens

And I love the fact that you're science-based. Yeah, absolutely. And you, you identify wouldn't have it any otherwise. You do the tough work, answer the problem, then you build the best quality unit out there. So thank you very much for sharing your insight, the and the new hero and the the moxie 1927.

I can't wait to hear the new technologies after that. Thank you, Aaron.

Aaron Burton

It's good seeing you Grant. Take care.

Dr. Grant Stevens

Hello everyone and welcome back to the Technology of Beauty, where I have the opportunity to interview the movers and the shakers of the beauty business. And today is no exception. Today we're gonna interview Saranya Wyles. I just met her, and then we're gonna learn all about her. We're here at the Aesthetic Innovation Summit in San Diego 2022.

Thank you very much for joining us and for joining me on the technology of. Thank you for having me. It's my pleasure. So tell me a little bit about yourself.

Dr. Saranya P. Wyles

Well, I'm a dermatologist at the Mayo Clinic. I also have a lab and I study a lot of different aspects of skin aging, including the a concept called cellular senescence.

Dr. Grant Stevens

Cellular senescence. Tell us about that.

Dr. Saranya P. Wyles

So cellular senescence is like a type of sulfate similar to when your cells divide and cells die and like apoptosis. So it's like a sulfate. So what that means is they go into a zombie sulfate. So instead of dying like normal cells, they are in limbo.

They don't die off or don't re. So why does this happen? You may ask. And it's because it's actually an evolutionally conserved process. So in a lot of Excels that get mutations you. Cells, Togo under senescence so that they can stop. So they don't hurt. Stop dividing. Exactly. Yeah.

But this actually happens with aging. So we get a lot of cells like fibroblasts, which make collagen and melanocytes, which contribute to pigment. And when they undergo senescence, they actually increase the aging process and cause a lot of different signals that contribute to.

Dr. Grant Stevens

When you say contribute to aging, do you mean like say wrinkles or pigmentary changes or what, what is aging in your sentence? What's that mean?

Dr. Saranya P. Wyles

Yeah. So aging from a systemic perspective has been really well studied from a cells esce concept. So there are different hallmarks of aging. So our cells from a molecular perspective can have telomere attrition or have mutations and change in that DNA structure. So aging, we constantly think about it from a chronological aging.

How do. Like how does the wrinkles present? How do the volume loss present? But I'm talking about the molecular aging, the biological clock.

Dr. Grant Stevens

So, are you working with Rion?

Dr. Saranya P. Wyles

I am, so, Rion Aesthetics. So, I am a collaborator with Rion. So I am the lead investigator and the principal investigator in our clinical studies.

So a lot of the studies that we take. Carry out at the Mayo Clinic Center for Aesthetic Medicine and Surgery are funded by our partners with Rion.

Dr. Grant Stevens

So that means you're using exosomes, correct? And how do the exosomes interact with these cells that are falling asleep?

Dr. Saranya P. Wyles

Exactly. So they are doing a good job because they're actually helping clear these cells.

So that's called, the process is called lysis. Senescence clearance. So you want to clear these cells so that your body can naturally regenerate again and contribute to holistic regeneration and healing. And the innate repair mechanism, so the ryon exosomes that we're using are platelet derived exosomes that we apply topically are actually helping to reduce these factors of aging.

Dr. Grant Stevens

So they don't wake 'em up, they actually get rid of them. They kick them out.

Dr. Saranya P. Wyles

They kick 'em out. The immune system comes in and the clears them out.

Dr. Grant Stevens

They say, you're outta here. You're sleeping. You're outta here. Then what stimulates new ones to come in in their place?

Dr. Saranya P. Wyles

So the, we can think about 'em as a rotten apple, so a rotten apple spoiling the whole cart.

So if you have a bad senescent cells, it's actually talking to the other healthy cells. And it's creating. Negative environment. So if you clear them out, the other cells sort of wake up and say, I need to be making more collagen. I need to be making more elastin and contribute to that healthy aging environment.

Dr. Grant Stevens

And tell me how are you documenting this?

Dr. Saranya P. Wyles

So there are a lot, great question, because that's a very debated topic. So I'm part of this NIH geoscience group, and we get together and talk about different markers of senescence. So markers like p16INK 4a and P21 are different ways that we can quantify.

Cells, senescence. We can also look at senescence, β-Gal staining. So basically the different ways like we call 'em like different shades of senescence. So, and you have to put 'em together to figure out.

Dr. Grant Stevens

Shades of senescence. Wow. That's a mouthful. Keep going.

Dr. Saranya P. Wyles

And so to get the idea of the pool picture, we look at these different parts of the puzzle and then we can say, this is how it's working together.

And look at these different markers to better quantify that molecular aging.

Dr. Grant Stevens

These exosomes are applied topically, correct?Do you ever put them as an injectable subq or intramuscular or intradermal or they always applied on top of the skin?

Dr. Saranya P. Wyles

Yeah, so we have a medical grade version of the exosome product that we can use for injectable application.

And so that's some of the areas that we're exploring right now to be able to use. Biostimulators potentially load exosomes with other deliverables as drug delivering area goes. So that's in our medical portfolio and really hoping to expand that over the next year.

Dr. Grant Stevens

Your concentration though, if I understand this right, is in, this is in the dermatologic area.

Correct. And the aesthetics for derm, and I've heard exosomes being used for all sorts of things, cardiac and so forth, other medical uses, that's not your emphasis, is that correct?

Dr. Saranya P. Wyles

Correct. Under my area of expertise. But we do work with a lot of other Mayo Clinic investigators and external invest. To explore this area because the root of the science actually came from cardiology.

And when we're looking at patients with heart failure and how they responded to certain stem cell therapies, we actually found that the high responders had certain exosome portfolios. And what made them special was that they actually had these signals that were enhanced. So that's really where the idea stemmed from.

So the cardiology has great potential for this technology.

Dr. Grant Stevens

Oh, this is very, very exciting. Thank you so much for joining us. How are you liking the AIS? This must be your first AIS.

Dr. Saranya P. Wyles

This is my first AIS. I'm loving this. This has been a great opportunity to meet with so many different people. I'm telling you AIS is where early adopters are present, and then you can really feel that energy here.

Dr. Grant Stevens

Yeah. Well, great. Well, this is our third year. We did an 18, 19, now 22. And it's great to have you. I hope you come back and join us next year. We'll be down in Miami. We always are the day before the start of the Aesthetic Society Show, which is the American Society for Aesthetic Plastic Surgery, and that show starting tomorrow.

And we like to put the technology of beauty on the night, or excuse me, AIS on the day before. So thank you for joining us.

Dr. Saranya P. Wyles

Thank you for having us.

Dr. Grant Stevens

See you around. Yeah, I wanna learn more from you. Absolutely. Take care.

Dr. Saranya P. Wyles

Thank you. Take care.

Dr. Grant Stevens

Hello everyone and welcome back to the Technology of Beauty where I have the opportunity to interview the movers and shakers of the beauty business. And today is no exception. Today I'm gonna be interviewing Dr. Atta Behfar from Rion and also the Mayo. Thank you for joining me.

Dr. Atta Behfar

Pleasure to be here.

Dr. Grant Stevens

It's great to have you on the show. We're here in San Diego, California at the aesthetic Innovation Summit meeting 2022 and Rion, the company Rion, has made some presentations and we're talking today about exosomes. And regenerative medicine. Absolutely. So tell us a little bit about yourself. You're a physician.

Dr. Atta Behfar

I'm a physician. I do heart transplant at Mayo. I've spent 20 years in the regenerative medicine research space, mostly focused on stem cells. But lately, over the last decade, we've changed our minds. It's the exosomes that are the active ingredient for regeneration.

Dr. Grant Stevens

Is it stem cells versus exosomes, or are exosomes part of the stem?

Dr. Atta Behfar

It's not stem cells versus exosomes. It's just that what's beneficial from stem cells is exosomes. What we realize though is that when you culture stem cells in a Petri dish, make 'em grow, their tendency when they're really regenerative is to actually trap serological exosomes and actually platelet derived exo.

They grab them and then when you try to use them clinically, it's those exosomes that they're releasing, that incite regenerative event. So they're really recycling platelet exosomes from the Petri dish to drive regenerative events. So when we saw that, We thought, why use this middle man? Why not just go to the source and just use the platelets?

Dr. Grant Stevens

That's interesting. So can the stem cell be thought of as sort of the courier that's carrying around the active ingredient, which is actually the exosome? Is that what really has the positive, the beneficial effect?

Dr. Atta Behfar

I think when you look at the literature, especially over the last, I would say five to 10, The Pericrine secretions, that's what's been called of stem cells.

Is really now thought of as the active component. Well, what's in that secretion is the exosome.

Dr. Grant Stevens

Okay. So at Rion? Switching gears a little bit. You provide the exosomes for various uses, is that correct?

Dr. Atta Behfar

We're an ex exosome innovation hub. We licensed several technologies that actually came out of my lab at Mayo. That really focus on derivation and purification of regenerative exosomes.

Dr. Grant Stevens

Now you harvest or obtain these exosomes from platelets, is that correct? That's right. Now can your exosomes be injected into me?

Dr. Atta Behfar

Absolutely. So exosomes, and we've tested as a transplant doc, I'm very careful about this. So we've looked at exosomes and they don't appear to harbor cell or non-self.

So exosomes, unlike cells, are compatible across different individuals and in large part across different species. Even so we could put human exosomes and rabbits or pigs and look at how they work.

Dr. Grant Stevens

Okay, couple questions. The, are there multiple types of exosomes?

Dr. Atta Behfar

Yeah. So if you think about the number of cells you have in your body.

Millions of different types of cells, each of those. Makes many different types of exosomes.

Dr. Grant Stevens

So, so they're specific. I have cardiac exosomes, you have skin exosomes and so forth.

Dr. Atta Behfar

Absolutely. And all the different cells in your heart make different types of exosomes, all the different cells in your skin make different types of exosomes.

Each meant to do some very specific action. So when we hear the concept of exosomes, that doesn't equate regeneration. That just means you. A little particle that's shed by a cell. What we really focused on is which of these many millions of different exosomes actually can foster healing.

That's what we're interested in. And so even from platelets, if you treat the platelets wrong, as you're collecting these exosomes, you get things that we call tosome and inflammasome. Kilo songs. These are things that, these are bad exosomes. These are, well, they're not bad because if you have a cancer cell, those are great exosomes.

Sure. If you have an infection, the platelets do their job. They're great exosomes, but if you have a wound, they're terrible exosomes. Right? So for the right reason, those are wonderful for our use, which is in in regimen, we really. A focus on a particular exosome, which we call the regenesome or the regenerative exosome.

Dr. Grant Stevens

You, you said there's specific exosomes, say for the heart and even within the heart for the different cells of the heart.

Yeah. And yet you're telling me that you harvest these exosomes from the platelet if you're harvesting from the platelets. Do you actually harvest exosomes from the platelet that could be used potentially in the heart.

Dr. Atta Behfar

Yeah, so the platelet regenerative exosomes do drive blood vessel formation. So when you're healing a wound, you need new blood vessels.

Sure. Now think about individuals who may have had ischemic heart disease. So blockages typically you can get bypass, you can get a stent. All is okay, but certain individuals have so much blockage or really can't stent them anymore or bypass. They need their own heart to rebuild new blood vessels.

Yes. Biological bypass grafts. These platelet exosomes can do that for the heart. So just like they form blood vessels for the skin, now we can leverage the, that power and use it in a unique new way.

Dr. Grant Stevens

Would that fall into the field of angiogenesis?

Dr. Atta Behfar

So it would be, it would be angiogenesis or vascular genesis.

The way I think about angiogenesis, when your body is being formed as a fetus, you need to make all these blood vessels all over when you actually have red blood cell containing blood vessels. I think about that more as vascular genesises. I think of like, so what we see with the exosomes, it's not just what you see with VEGF that drives angiogenin and you get like a rat's nest worth of blood vessels.

You actually. A compliment of signals, and it's a complex biologic, but there are agonists and antagonists built within these exosomes that drive all the key steps needed to form a functional blood vessel. And so what you see at the end of the day when you deploy these exosomes and tissues where you're getting wound healing or if you're using them in the heart, is you see circles with red blood cells in them on histology, really?

So they're actually functional blood vessel.

Dr. Grant Stevens

How big are these molecules?

Dr. Atta Behfar

They're tiny.

Dr. Grant Stevens

How many kilodaltons would be a typical exosome.

Dr. Atta Behfar

So we typically measure them based on their diameter and they're between 50 and 150 nanometers. But you could catch 'em easily on a 300 kilodalton filter.

Dr. Grant Stevens

Do you have any challenges getting them through the skin barrier and actually delivering them subcutaneously or intramuscularly or other areas besides the epi-, the dermis?

Dr. Atta Behfar

So what's very interesting about platelet derived exosomes is actually the same thing that's interesting about platelets.

They're sticky. So when you get a cut, that's a good thing. They'll stick. They, you want 'em to stay. Those integr are carried forward on the skin of the exosomes. And so when you put them in the muscle, if you put them subcutaneously, if you put 'em in the heart, they stick. If you put 'em on a tumor, let's say you load 'em with a chemotherapy, they stick there and they don't move.

Okay? And so from a pharmacokinetics standpoint, as a drug delivery, They're very unique in that you can target them specifically to the area of interest.

Dr. Grant Stevens

So I get that they're stay, they stay put. But how do they get through the skin?

Dr. Atta Behfar

Oh, so what we've seen in the most recent posh study is that they actually can penetrate the strata, and we see them as deep.

The reticular dermis stuck on collagen cuz collagen has integre binding sites. And when we go back and look and track the exosomes, they're actually getting in through the pores. So you see almost the pore almost looks like a well at the bottom of exosomes. And then they get into the skin from there.

Dr. Grant Stevens

So they don't track through the hair follicle?

Dr. Atta Behfar

They also track, so through the pores, through any sort of, any of that. You can see them.

Dr. Grant Stevens

Surface or in the dermis. They follow that as a track?

Dr. Atta Behfar

They follow those as a track.

Dr. Grant Stevens

Interesting. Well this is so exciting. There's so much to learn about rejuvenative medicine in general, but in particular exosomes.

And I want to thank you for joining us today on the technology of beauty and for coming to AIS. I assume this is your first AIS.

Dr. Atta Behfar

This is definitely.

Dr. Grant Stevens

You're a heart surgeon, you're here running around with guys like me who are aesthetic plastic surgeons.

Dr. Atta Behfar

Well, it's it's honestly, I think a unique opportunity to combine forces and learn from each other.

Absolutely.

Dr. Grant Stevens

I agree. Well, thank you very much. I look forward to having you back on the show. Thank you. And thank you for joining us. Take care.

Dr. Atta Behfar

Take care.

Dr. Grant Stevens

Hello everyone and welcome back to the Technology Beauty, where I have an opportunity to interview the movers and shakers of the beauty business. And today is no exception. We're welcoming back Mr. Rob Catlin, who is from Endo and he's here and in San Diego at Aesthetic Innovation Summit or AIS. 2022. He just came down off stage and we have a chance to interview him about his exciting technology, Qwo.

Welcome back, Rob.

Rob Catlin

Grant. Thank you so much for having me. I was on episode 11 about a year and a half ago, and I'm so excited to be back and I continue to be a fan listening about every two weeks when you drop a new episode. So it's wonderful to be back. Thank you.

Dr. Grant Stevens

Well, we now have over 50 episodes and you can see 'em on the technology of beauty.

It's just evolved and it's on YouTube, as you know. Of course. And you were number 11. That's right. Lucky number 11. And now you'll be number 50 or 60 something. Awesome. That's great. So what has happened in the last year or so? Couple years? Well, with Endo and, and particularly with Qwo and with you.

Rob Catlin

Yeah. Well, when we spoke last, it was September of 2021, we'd received our FDA a approval that July. But as you know that was the height of, of COVID 19. And so we ended up delaying our launch to. Of 2021. So we're very excited. We actually just celebrated our one year anniversary for Launching Qwo.

Oh, congratulations. Literally congratulations a year ago. Congratulations off this time, and thank you very much. And it's an exciting time. Cite continues to be an area of unmet need for plastic sermons and dermatologists and their patients, and participating on this. Panel today was great because they got to talk about endo aesthetics and Qwo, but we also got to hear about Revelle and Soluton and I think there's just a tremendous opportunity no matter what the technology is.

So it was very exciting and it's great to be back at AIS.

Dr. Grant Stevens

Yeah, it's great to have you here. You've been at other AIS.

Rob Catlin

We were an inaugural sponsor of AIS back in New York and there probably in 2018. That's right. And so it's been amazing to see this conference progress. The thing I love about this congress is the fact that it's, it's not only industry, it's physicians, but it's also the financial industry.

And there's so much new information, new technology you're writing out right now, what's gonna be around in a couple years. Absolutely. So, absolutely. It's one of my favorite events for.

Dr. Grant Stevens

Having the capital markets here in the investment community is really exciting because they get a chance to hear from the innovators and the new startups and people like yourself.

Corporate giants. Giants. So you were here in 19 18, 19 and now 22. And That's right. I want to thank you for being a loyal supporter.

Rob Catlin

Thank you. And it's a tremendous opportunity. You do a fantastic job. It's great to be here. I'm just amazed at the, the quality of the presentations, the faculty, and again I feel like I'm blowing smoke at you, but the, the, the things we're able to learn about I love talking about cellulite, love talking about endo, aesthetics and Qwo, but just whether it be skin rejuvenation, hair transplants, all the technologies, I'm not even saying it right.

The regenerative market, there's so much to learn and to that's so exciting about the future of aesthetics.

Dr. Grant Stevens

That's what's really cool about it. We learned so much from the presenters. I mean, I just heard some new things about exosomes that I didn't know. It's really exciting to come to a meeting and actually learn stuff from the actual from the experts, the world experts.

Rob Catlin

Exactly. You gotta take a paper and pen and learn about and write some stuff down because it's, it's, we're truly at the infancy. I, I know that listen, you've been in the aesthetics industry a long time. As a plastic surgeon, I'm a little more junior than you. We're still the infancy of this market, whether you be a plastic surgeon, whether you be an industry giant as you say.

But no, there's just, we're the beginning and there's so much technology, so much innovation that's coming. It's, it's a place to be.

Dr. Grant Stevens

Absolutely. I couldn't agree with you more. Well, Rob, thank you very much for joining us today. It's a pleasure seeing you. I look forward to seeing you at the rest of the meeting here of The Aesthetic Society, and thank you all for joining us here at this episode of the technology of beauty.

Hello everyone and welcome back to the Technology of Beauty where I have the opportunity to interview the movers and shakers of the beauty business. And today is no exception. Today we have the opportunity to interview Dr. Lou Bucky. Lou is not only a friend, a colleague, he's he's a great guy, a very accomplished surgeon.

He has multiple offices, and he's been in this business for almost as long as I have. Lou, thank you very much for joining us today.

Dr. Louis P. Bucky

Thanks for having me, Grant.

Dr. Grant Stevens

Now before we get started, we are here at the Aesthetic Innovation Summit 2022. You've been up on stage and we've been having a great time here at ais, and thank you for coming to AIS.

Dr. Louis P. Bucky

My pleasure. Yeah, honor to be here. It's a uniquely engaging forum, forum for docs and industry. To try and speak about what helps patients and to evaluate both how it gives physicians a voice to see how industry can help our patients. Because we have a unique opportunity to know what patients really want.

Industry never crosses that border between the physician and patient relationship, and so it's something that we hold onto ourselves, that when we look at industry present stuff that we, they think would be good for our patients, we're still the final pathway. And I love listening to that. And having input.

Dr. Grant Stevens

And the smart ones recognize that we also have capital here. We have the financial capital, the horsepower.

Dr. Louis P. Bucky

So probably partly part of while we advocate for patients, we typically don't get in front of people who have capital. We don't have, get in front of people who can make decisions on what's provided and what's not.

And so this forum is uniquely good. You had a great idea when you started it and it's getting better.

Dr. Grant Stevens

That's fantastic. Now tell us a little bit about yourself.

Dr. Louis P. Bucky

Plastic surgeon in Philadelphia. Been in practice, it'll be 25 years this year. I have four offices in Philadelphia and do a lot of facial breast surgery.

But also like yourself, I've had the good fortune to be involved with industry innovation development of. New products and most importantly, new services that help patients bring plastic surgery to patients and make plastic surgery better for patients.

Dr. Grant Stevens

Yeah, that's what's great and it's really a pleasure working with you. Tell us a little bit about the exact product to start.

Dr. Louis P. Bucky

The exact is a very interesting device that, that we have had the opportunity to work together with that allows there's a big trend in facial surgery to make things less invasive and plastic surgery's an interesting area where.

There's surgery and then there's the fillers, which are non-invasive, and there's nothing in between. There's no minimally invasive area where other specialties have that, and the exact device is the, is a minimally invasive device that allows us to move. Tissues, the neck, the midface in through very small incisions and very gentle process that can make patients look better without the recovery, without general anesthesia.

And it's filling a void in plastic surgery that patients will benefit from.

Dr. Grant Stevens

That's terrific. And how many patients have you done it on? Approximately?

Dr. Louis P. Bucky

Between Dr. Godick and myself, we've done 377 patients, presenting it at Hot Topics tomorrow. The young person's neck who isn't as tight as it used to be and isn't ready for a facelift is an ideal patient.

The patient who's had a facelift and doesn't want to go through a full other one, but their necks getting laxed ideal. Patient who's having volume loss and is tired of having fillers or the fillers aren't working as well, midface to a small incision, ideal patient. And so there, there are a lot of 'em out there that benefit from exact.

Dr. Grant Stevens

No question. Yeah, there are a lot of people that don't want a full facelift, but they wanna look their very best. You were talking about patient five. Why don't you tell us a little bit about PatientFi. What is it, who's it good for? How's it helping the industry?

Dr. Louis P. Bucky

So, PatientFi is a FinTech company that has been dev was evolved to become the friendly way for patients to finance surgery.

Not everybody can afford to have the surgery that they need or want to improve the quality of their life. There are others out there that finance both surgery and other things that if charge high interest rates, charge the dock a lot of money to be able to, to do that. And if patients are late in their payments, it can be, very.

So there was an opportunity to set up a finance company that was both friendly for the doctor, provider, and friendly for the patient who is the borrower. And it's called patient five. And we set up terms that make things much easier. We understand the journey that patients go through, and one of the anxieties or limitations is, can I afford this?

So instead of coming out of pocket with a lot of money, you can do it on a monthly basis. There is protection in terms of. Credit ability, your ability to pay, and if you are late, we can work with you. It's not as penal. And we're even moving into the space of fillers and injectables so that you could set up.

An annual plan for $99 a month or $85 a month. And the beauty of that is if you think about Botox and fillers and disport and the other neurotoxins, instead of getting one treatment waiting for it to go away, then calling the office for another. And then so your, your appearance goes like this up and down.

If you set up an annual plan and you set up your appoint. You will never look off, you will always look good. You will always stay up to date with your treatments. And it's a way to do it in a, in a fashion that is affordable and consistent which is great for the doc because he doesn't have to reengage and it's gr even better for the patient who always looks good.

We call it Ageless Beauty and this company. Is been started and developed with the input of docs invested originally by physicians and has a team that's fantastic, understands the journey of what patients go through.

Dr. Grant Stevens

So it's like lease payments on a car.

Dr. Louis P. Bucky

Right. In many ways.

Dr. Grant Stevens

In many ways. So they, they budget for it. And I'm sure the, everyone likes that, but I'm sure the millennials especially love that. I've seen some statistics about the percentage of people. Who actually do budget for and pay monthly payments, various things, the cars and so forth.

Dr. Louis P. Bucky

Millennials are, are the millennial. The millennials are sort of the key of buy now, pay later.

Yeah. But the other piece to this is it does, it puts you on a budget. It doesn't do hard credit checks, so your credit score doesn't get injured by it. Again, we, we have set up the friendliest process for both patients and physicians.

Dr. Grant Stevens

I wanna stress that there's no hard credit. So if you do this and you see if you're qualified, it does.

It's not a ding against your credit. The other nice thing about this is patients such as yourself or your patients can do this before they come in to see you or before you come in to see the physician. So you can literally go online. You can find out if you qualify before you walk in and see the physician.

So that's nice to know. Yes, a lot of people don't know, but they are credit worthy for this type of thing, be it Botox filler or even breast augmentation and so forth. And you partnered with Allergan recently and others. Hundred percent. And that facilitates and it's good for the patient, it's good for the doctor, it's good for industry. I applaud what you've done.

Dr. Louis P. Bucky

Thank you. And the, the beauty is today, you don't need to just look at FICA scores. Some people are able to make payments looking at their financial capabilities in ways that are different than what we used to do. We have merged the barrier between the thinking of banks or lender.

And the thinking of patients, the borrowers, and used our experience in plastic surgery, in healthcare, dentistry, ophthalmology to merge that and allow it to happen. And so I think that it is a very patient, friendly, affordable way for patients to get the care they want in a fashion that limits the anxiety of can I afford it.

Dr. Grant Stevens

There you have it. Well, thank you very much Dr. Bucky, so for coming here as usual,

Dr. Louis P. Bucky

I appreciate it. Always nice to be with you.

Dr. Grant Stevens

Yeah, it's great.

Hello everyone and welcome back to the Technology of Beauty where I have the opportunity to interview the movers and shakers of the beauty business. And today is no exception. With us today is Craig Simak, who is the founder and owner of AIS, the Aesthetic Innovation Summit, and we're here in San Diego at AIS 2022 and Craig.

Offer to sit down. I've been chasing this guy down. I've never had him on the show. And finally I have him on the show. Craig, thank you so much for coming.

Craig Simak

Hey, it is honestly an honor because I was, as I've been telling you, I am one of the, probably one of your biggest fans for the podcast because for me it is instrumental in not only staying up to date on what's happening in the field, but really even learning the history. So you've had all types of innovators on the show. And so it's given me a great foundation for my own personal learning. And then as we look forward as we're producing programs, it's a good springboard for that as well.

Dr. Grant Stevens

That's great. So you didn't come from an aesthetic background. Did you come from ophthalmology?

Craig Simak

Well, so I, my, I have a background in finance, but I've been producing financial conferences for 24 years, and then through that I got into venture capital and then into healthcare. And then from healthcare I started looking at different verticals.

So what started in, in the medical device space, then got into digital health and then into ophthalmology more specifically. So, but in the medical device arena is where I got to meet Mark Foley, who's our common friend. And Mark and I brainstormed this idea for this conference and you were the first person that, that Mark said, we need to, rally.

Grant and get him into the mix on this. And then I think once we did that, you just like ran with it. It was like, we gave you the ball and you ran with it. Like, this is awesome.

Dr. Grant Stevens

And Josh was with us too.

Craig Simak

Josh was with us too.

Dr. Grant Stevens

Yes. So we did the show in 2018 in New York. That was our inaugural show.

Craig Simak

Yeah. And, wow, we're onto something big here. And I honestly, I wasn't sure at the time if there was a need for this type of a meeting. Because there's obviously a lot of clinical meeting. But nothing that brought together finance and industry with the clinicians. And so, but you thought it was a good idea, which was a good start.

And then we put together an interesting program and we had a great response. And so that led to the next year. And then Covid hit and we had to take a two year hiatus. But we're back and it feels really good. The numbers are pretty much back where we, where we. In 2019. So I'm hoping from here we'll keep the traction and momentum going and we're learning a lot and I think we'll come up with some new topic ideas for next year.

We're already discussing some

Dr. Grant Stevens

stuff.

Yeah. You and I have already been brainstorming. Storming. So we're here at the West End here in San Diego, and next year we'll be in Miami. That'll be we always have this meeting just before the Aesthetic Society meeting. That's the American Society for Aesthetic Plastic Surgery, the number one aesthetic society in the world.

But I really love the fact that you do follow us around and we do this the day before. We get a lot more docs coming to it. And industry is really gravitating to this. The number of people that have hit me up today for next year's program is crazy Good. How are you feeling about this show today?

Craig Simak

I'm really happy about it and I think it's been really interesting. I think the recurring theme keeps coming up around the exosomes. Like it just seems like there's unlimited potential. The buzz there. So that's really interesting. We're gonna have to feature that on the next program for sure. You mentioned the Aesthetic Society and I, I just have to.

Say that Sue Dykema has been phenomenal and they've been so embracing of this, where's that actually surprised me because I wasn't sure if they would be resistant to the idea, but from the onset it might have helped that you were the president at the, at the time, or incoming president at the time.

But they've been really supportive and in terms of marketing it and even having their board members coming over here, they've been encouraging them to part. And I think you're right, that's the key to the success of this, is that having the clinical community behind it, otherwise as a standalone meeting, it might not get as much participation from clinicians.

Dr. Grant Stevens

Well, you've included so many members and leaders from the Aesthetic Society on your panels and so forth, and you've been very inclusive and respectful of the society and the different rules that we have and so forth. And I would say it's a very symbio. Meeting, we work well with ais and vice versa, so thank you.

Thank too, we were at Sue's party last night. She just celebrated her 25th anniversary of working for the Aesthetic Society. Wow. Can you imagine working with 25 presidents and all the rest, but that's a testament to her.

Craig Simak

Yes. I mean, that's what I mean. She's a wonderful human being.

Dr. Grant Stevens

Sue Dykema. So what's the future of AIS?

Craig Simak

So I think from here we'll continue to identify new trends. And I think the, the benefit of this is that we have we get to cover the topics that everyone's already talking about, and then we start to scratch the surface on the areas that are new and fresh and people wanna learn more about.

So again, we came back to exosomes, I think is good. Well, you'll tell me. I'm sure you'll get more feedback than I will, but we'll, I'm sure we have a few ideas for next year already. I don't think we need to change the format. I think we have a winning model. Here with this program. So would agree.

I'm looking forward to, to Miami in 2023. Oh, the one in, I'm glad you're mentioning this can. So explain this sentence everybody. This is new for this year. Two things we did differently this year was we had a workshop this morning on entrepreneurship and innovation, which was standing room only, and we didn't know what to expect from that, but it seemed like there was a lot of interest in that.

So that's the other thing we need to. So industry people have been at this for a long time. Clinicians not so much about like, even though they're PR in their practice, they're entrepreneurial, but maybe they have a great idea for a technology, but they don't know the process. Right? To get a new product tomorrow or launching a product, raising money, getting patents, and getting it to market.

So today was just a beginning of that. I think we'll continue to do that. And then we introduced the aesthetic innovator. This year as well, which is voting by the audience. So it may be a popularity vote, we're not sure. So we'll, we'll figure that out. Maybe there's a, a different way, maybe we'll come up with some judges in the future, but this year we just wanted to introduce it and acknowledge some of the companies that presented today.

Dr. Grant Stevens

Yeah, I think that's great. We're gonna be doing that in a little while.

Craig Simak

Yeah, exactly. So it'll be exciting to. Who wins. Absolutely.

Dr. Grant Stevens

Yeah. Well, again, thank you very much for joining us here at the Technology of Beauty and for allowing us to set up at your program at AIS Aesthetic Innovation Summit.

Craig Simak

It's honestly a pleasure.

Dr. Grant Stevens

This is fantastic. We've been able to interview 15, 16 people that are presenters and various industry titans and. And clinicians and finance guys. It's been great. So thank you very much for having us, allowing my pleasure us to do that. This is fantastic. It's fantastic being your co-chair.

Craig Simak

Yeah. And well, you're, you're stuck with me. We'll have to figure out going forward for next year. We'll see. We'll have to figure out who the co-chairs will be with you. But you're stuck with me. So anyway, thank you so much.

Dr. Grant Stevens

Thank you, Craig. You take care.

Hello everyone and welcome back to the Technology of Beauty where I have the opportunity to interview the movers and shakers of the beauty business. And today is no exception. We have a guest who was on earlier, Michael Borner, who is the CEO and co-founder of Engaged Technologies. Welcome Michael.

Michael Boerner

Dr. Stevens, great to be with you, and someone has to interview you because you are the mover and shaker of the aesthetic business.

Dr. Grant Stevens

Well, maybe you can do that one day, but for now, I get to interview you first. Let me set the stage. We are here at the 2022 AIS. Aesthetic Innovation Summit, and we're here in beautiful San Diego, California, and Engaged Technologies is here.

And they also are gonna be at the Aesthetic Society Show. That's the annual show for the American Society of Aesthetic Plastic Surgery. And they are, they have a booth. Booth number 13, 14, if I'm not mistaken. And there's some exciting breaking news that you're gonna share with our listeners and watchers, what's up?

Michael Boerner

Well, this is a historic week, as you said. We have been in process with this for over a year, and thanks to a number of phenomenal leaders in the a. Space. We have a brand new library, which is a phase one release that's coming out this week. And so we finally now have an opportunity after many, many months of work with some of the great doctors walking through the entire patient journey experiences.

We call them our whiteboard story arc sessions. And so you've participated in several of those. And now we have an opportunity to take all of that preparatory work and release it into the practice hands. And so we'll have a release specifically for our surgical audience, which will begin in phase one with breast augmentation, as well as mastopexy, as well as revision.

And so that will be now available, which walks the patient all the way through pre-consult education, post consult education, and then pre and post. Education. So it really holds their hand all the way through that entire journey. It's an extraordinarily well designed piece of work that's got this emotional through line to it that will really help that patient feel relaxed, lower their anxiety, and really take a huge burden off of the staff.

Dr. Grant Stevens

That's very exciting. And will the surgeons in attendance at the meeting be able to get their hands on that library?

Michael Boerner

They will. It's, so our model is like Netflix for business. So it's a monthly subscription that's very inexpensive. Then they receive all of the content, all of the technology, which is wrapped in that practice brand, and it's delivered through, through mobile intelligence, which is our mobile technology.

And that allows the patient to receive it on their mobile device via text. Okay? And then it's wrapped in that practice look and feel.

Dr. Grant Stevens

And what about non surgicals? What are your plans there?

Michael Boerner

So, non-surgical, we have a whole release that's coming out. We're starting with neuromodulators and fillers, so that's the first release that'll come out this week as well.

So that will be offered as a standalone and it'll also be paired with a surgical library. And then we have a great number of new parts of that library, which will be coming out in later parts of the year. So we'll just continue to add the most popular procedures that will follow along surgical and nonsurgical pathway.

Dr. Grant Stevens

How will a patient find this information?

Michael Boerner

So the patient delivery really is one of three ways. It's, so the first way is for the practice to use something called our My Guide, which is a simple portal on any Mac or pc, they just simply send a text to the patient while they're at home. They receive it on their phone, but it can be done through a simple portal that we've made for the practice.

It's a simple URL that's designed for the practice brand, so they don't have to install any software, and all they have to do is ask for the patient's phone number, their cell number. And their. And they put it into our guide and it sends it right to the patient. The other way is they can actually scan one of our guides right there in the practice.

And so when they scan it, it does a text right into our mobile technology. But again, it's wrapped in the practice brand. So that's the second way. And the third, which we're quite excited about, is an integration into the practice management system itself. And so the staff does what they normally do, scheduling appointments, and then it automatically connects with our platform and then sends out that communication directly to the patient with no new human interaction from the team.

Dr. Grant Stevens

So if a new patient were to call him making a, a consult, having never been in the practice, is there a. You can push that content to them. They can read it or watch it before they come in and see the doctor.

Michael Boerner

Exactly. So as we integrate the practices, when they subscribe, we're actually going to be in. Incurring that costs ourselves and putting the integration as a part of our subscription.

And so we'll actually put a small piece of software onto the IT person's hands there at the practice. And that runs a simple report that pulls out only that patient data that's relevant to that particular workflow. And that way the, the staff doesn't have to do any additional work after integration once it's set up.

Dr. Grant Stevens

And is it based on their cell phone? And so it's sent to text.

Michael Boerner

Name and cell phone, that's exactly right.

Dr. Grant Stevens

So they get the information on their text and then this is before they walk into the practice.

Michael Boerner

Correct. And of course, the real benefit of pre-education, we see this in some of our other market verticals.

And as a doctor when you're, and if you're in a college education situation and you talk to freshmen all day, it's very different than talking to senior. Where do we park? How does this work? What time is lunch? So when it comes to a practice, being able to have people pre-educated before they come in, save so much time on the staff, so much better used time with the doctor because suddenly that dwell time is much more educated.

The patients come in prepared to be able to have discussions that are much more mature. In their process.

Dr. Grant Stevens

And you have experience in other verticals. You've done this in ophthalmology, optometry, and dentistry, correct?

Michael Boerner

Correct. And we have new forays into orthopedic surgery, knee, hip, spine, et cetera.

But they'll follow that same pattern, which is how do you better educate a patient and that trusted relationship between provider and patient themselves. But what we all want is something that's fast and easy, that's delivered at what we call height of interest, time of need, and when it comes in via mobile, everyone prefers text nowadays.

Yes, of course. But when they get the text, it's got a tiny little link in it that when they tap the link, it opens up the short sequence of video content. From their doctor. So no one knows we're involved at all. We wanna make it look like the practice has invented the entire process.

Dr. Grant Stevens

Can the doctor personalize the message?

Michael Boerner

They can. And so we've designed it so it doesn't require any production or shooting at all. But for those practices that would like, we make it very easy for them to drop in their own video greeting right into the workflow. So it makes it simple for them to appear on the video content as well. And of course, it's surrounded by their look and feel all around the content in the platform, in addition.

Dr. Grant Stevens

That's very interesting and very exciting. Now, what about industry? Are you working with industry at all? Any of the industry partners?

Michael Boerner

We are. One of the most important components for a practice is for that staff and those doctors to be able to educate the patients. Well, many times industry provides some of the greatest methodologies of education for their tremendous products.

They've spent huge amounts of R&D money on. And so we're working with great companies like Allergan, Revance, Galderma, MERS, some of the great organizations that have a method of educating their patients. But what we do is we work with the manufacturers to make sure their story is told very, very effectively, exactly the way they want it.

And then the doctor has an opportunity to use the manufacturer's content to educate their patient. Ah, and for those docs to say, you know what? I'd rather just do a, a generic or universal method here. I don't wanna mention a specific brand because I'm not sure what they may present with. We also have a generic or universal way to educate about the same thing.

Dr. Grant Stevens

Now in the case of educating patients, we'll say on the breast surgery you mentioned breast augmentation, breast revision, and mass apex. The patients are gonna be in this journey you're talking about, where did you get the information? How do you, how do how do I know as a surgeon that this information is accurate?

You mentioned that you're whiteboarding with the KOLs and so forth, but is that the only source of your information?

Michael Boerner

Yeah. The information, what you're bringing up is incredibly important because the editorial integrity of the content, of course, is p. To the practices, subscribing to the content. And so we have a number of ways we get the information.

Primarily it comes from the, the key opinion leaders from our medical advisory board. So our medical advisory board is made up of some of the best minds across those multiple disciplines. We spend huge amounts of time with them mapping the entire patient experience. We also bring it by the teams, not just the doctors, but also the administrators, the.

The people who deal with the patients in a non-surgical and non, you know invasive way. And we also have industry for the industry content being reviewed and going through the legal processes and the hoops that are very important to that process as well. So it's some of the most reviewed content in the world, and most importantly, it isn't just clinically accurate, it's designed to really lower the anxiety and create the feeling that that patient's having their hand held by that practice all the way through every part and every step of the journey.

Dr. Grant Stevens

Is the aesthetic society involved at all?

Michael Boerner

They are, in fact, the Aesthetic Society, we are very grateful because of a major core portion of our content comes from the Aesthetic Society's Guide, which is at surgery.org, which is an extraordinary continuum of content that's also been developed by some of the great doctors.

And so we have a wonderful partnership with the Aesthetic Society to be able to have that editorial root and core that's built into our fabric of the content. So it's a great participation for some of the most vetted experiences that I think you'll ever see.

Dr. Grant Stevens

That's fantastic. Well, thank you very much for appearing here on the technology beauty and the Aesthetic Innovation Summit.

Have a great show. And I'll certainly pop by your booth. Well, thank you. 1314 on the, on the exhibit floor. Thank you Michael.

Michael Boerner

Pleasure to be with you. Excited about this week.