Elevating & Standardizing Aesthetic Before & After Photos

Max Baybak

Hello, hello out there. Max here, co-founder and Chief Growth Officer at Influx Marketing, and today we're at the Aesthetic Society meeting here at the Miami Beach Convention Center. This is the annual meeting of the American Society for Aesthetic Plastic Surgery. Every year I walk the aisles and I end up spending most of my time chatting with industry peers and marketing-minded physicians, and I always walk away really feeling like I have my finger on the pulse of what's happening in our space.

So this year I thought it'd be fun to take it a step further and have those same discussions that I always find myself having, but do it in a podcast format so that I can bring them to you at home. So if you're like me and you want to be dialed in on what's happening within the world of patient acquisition and digital marketing for aesthetic practices, follow along, and I hope to bring you some valuable insights through these conversations that you can use to take your practice to the next level. Can't take myself seriously. All right, let's roll with it.

Okay, and we're back, and now I'm joined by Jason Johnson, who is the founder and owner of Simple Studios, and I have to tell you about what he does, because we just met and I found it particularly fascinating, and something that I think the industry really needs. So I'm going to introduce him here and let him tell you a little bit about it. Jason, thank you so much for joining us.

Jason Johnson

Hey Max, thanks for having me.

Max Baybak

Of course. So as people are going to find out, you spent a lot of time on the other side of camera, as you were just telling me, and you told me this is kind of a new experience for you, being —

Jason Johnson

This is really weird. Yeah, yeah, yeah, it's a little easier than I thought, but it's still weird, because I'm always behind the cameras and monitoring audio and whatever it takes, you know.

Max Baybak

Well, I like it. You're getting — your day in the sun is finally here.

Jason Johnson

No, well, I just want to help tell this story.

Max Baybak

Um, and so let me not jump the gun here and let you tell us a little bit about what Simple Studios does.

Jason Johnson

Simple Studios, uh, helps that problem that every practice — or I should say 90% of the practices — have out there, and that's before and after photography. How to take it — there's too many settings on the camera, there's lenses, there's heights, there's angles, there's lights, there's distances. What do you — how do you fix that? Um, so I've combined the last, say, nine years of professional photography in this space helping out pharma companies, and I put that into a package that can go into any space, uh, for any practice, whether it's a multi-use room or it's a dedicated photo room, and we can customize a photo solution that will get consistently beautiful photos every time.

Max Baybak

That's such a compelling value proposition, I have to say. Um, I got into doing marketing for aesthetic practices, but 11, 12 years ago one of the first early websites I worked on was a med spa in Beverly Hills that was just getting started, and we were just kind of deeply involved in everything, helping them write phone scripts. So, you know, at the end of the day, the effect of marketing relies on so many other things. You need to make sure that people at the front desk know what they're doing when the lead calls. You also need to make sure that those photos that are coming onto the website are — you know, we know from our analytics that's where everyone goes to right away, and where they spend the most time on a website.

Jason Johnson

Absolutely.

Max Baybak

And those need to be consistent, and we could talk a lot about that. But even at that time we're helping to train people on before and after photos, buying equipment — but it's, first of all, it's evolving all the time, and secondly, there's a lot to know, and I think it needs to be done by someone who's a specialist. You mentioned you have a career in doing media production, photo and video, for pharma, so you're obviously an expert on this, kind of on the actual technical, I think, aspect.

Jason Johnson

Yeah, yeah, I guess it's kind of weird to think of it like that, like a professional. But when you kind of tally up the hours, the years, and the amount of patients that you've photographed and the amount of people you've interviewed, um, you kind of get to that point. Um, and then it's everything back in the studio, of all the testing that I've done with different lights, different scenarios. So, um, a room this size, when you've got, you know, say four foot by seven foot — how do you deal with that? What type of lights? How big are they? What distance, what angle, and then what type of camera system do you put in? I mean, there's so many variables. Um, so I've used my professional side with the photo and video and then morphed it together, and, uh, yeah, I still love it.

Max Baybak

I'm willing to bet you put in your ten thousand hours.

Jason Johnson

Yeah, I think so — whatever that it takes to come, I think it's ten thousand hours, yeah, yeah.

Max Baybak

So I think you can call yourself an expert. Yeah, we've even toyed around with it, but it's not our specific area of domain expertise. Should we — we had, long ago, I was speaking with my partners: do we help do something to help make this consistent, maybe come up with a package, do something? But I really think partnering with someone like yourself would make the most sense, and like you said, there's no one-size-fits-all package, so being able to kind of go in there and tailor a solution —

Jason Johnson

Yeah, with the nimble thinking of actually understanding what all this equipment does is what's so key.

Max Baybak

So when I met you today and I found out that's what you do, and you're going around in these practices and setting this up, immediately, like, a light bulb went off for me. First of all, let's sit down and talk on the podcast, and let's talk more about how we can refer clients your way. Because, man, when they give us good photos, it makes your life easier.

Jason Johnson

It's life-changing, yeah.

Max Baybak

And we spent a long time developing proper solutions for a really great gallery, um, web gallery, but you know what, it still relies on those inputs and what we get given. Yeah, and it's hard sometimes to educate them on — if it's cropped this way or taken this way, I can't crop it consistent to that, you know. Right, we have workflows and things to do to make it look — to do it quickly, because we're processing oftentimes, sometimes, thousands of photos, but also we do our best to make it look good.

But I just got to see a setup that he has set up here at the show, and it's really impressive. It's this really cool cart with, uh, an excellent lens on the front and then the iPad on the back to be able to kind of see and ghost and guide the image. What do you call that?

Jason Johnson

So that's the Shuttle Pro. Um, yeah, it's got a laptop tray if you're going to use a laptop.

Max Baybak

Cool.

Jason Johnson

Um, I love the TouchMD software, using the Snap, Canon Connect, um, software system for it, and I have the iPad mounted to the back of the cart, so you can just pull up the patient chart, um, take the photo from it so you can see it. You can ghost in images, you can use the Snap Pro, which has ghosting features, um, and grid lines on there. The DSLR is just really just used as a lens, and there's nothing to it — it's kind of a dumb device in that situation, but it's just got the best lens. Um, it slides up and down, it's weightless on the Shuttle Pro.

That's great for a good-size room. You know, you need at least, like, say, six foot by nine foot, something like that — that's a pretty good size room to have. But we have other devices for smaller rooms.

Max Baybak

I saw that — the video, so, out from the ceiling.

Jason Johnson

Yep, we've got that. Um, and in the last couple of months I've developed another one, which I don't — I need to get, like, some sort of contest for naming it, because that's the name. But it mounts to the wall, it has the same slider system, but it will, um, still allow the same quality photos, but it's 11 inches off the wall. And so, because you just have — slim — you kind of look at your iPad and the camera is pointing this direction. So that's for really small rooms.

Max Baybak

Okay.

Jason Johnson

Where the ceiling may not work for various reasons — ceiling doesn't work, the floor doesn't work, like, there's just some odd situation.

Max Baybak

So that's what I love, is you adapted for each scenario. It really makes a lot of sense. So you have Shuttle Pro — what's the ceiling one called?

Jason Johnson

The Balance Pro.

Max Baybak

Is it like a slim — so, you know, I think of the terminology that TV companies use for their really flush-wall-mounted, slim-mounted — there is something in there, right? Because —

Jason Johnson

And that's really what it is, because, you know, I developed the products based off of the need. So, uh, Dr. Trussler out of Austin, Texas — I've done two photo rooms for him. His second one was a rhino room, and he says, I want to do nothing but rhino consultations in there — can you make something that pulls out of the ceiling? I'm like, well, yeah, doc, you know, I can build anything. Yeah, so let's do it. So a couple weeks later I sent him a note, I said, yeah, I got something. He said, okay, I'll fly you out. So I went out there and I installed it, and he still uses it. That was version one of what you saw the photos of, the Balance Pro.

Um, but it all comes from necessity. So as we're growing as a business, we're finding out new needs, and like I said, you know, a month ago — really small location, the door was positioned on the wrong side of this room, so I could not put the Balance, right, just nothing would work in there. So we've come up with what I'm calling internally the Wally, because it's a wall-mounted, right? Okay.

Max Baybak

Flush Now Pro, the Slim Pro — I don't know, there's something there. But yeah, I would look, yeah, at what the TV companies do, because they're all — that's been, you know, a huge value prop, is look how slim we can make it against the wall on it. Yeah, could be a terrible idea. I'll join your contest when you, uh, officially —

Jason Johnson

Yeah, I gotta put that out there.

Max Baybak

So, yeah, so you also get involved in the software — that's what it — you know, you mentioned TouchMD. If they have recommendations on, or if they're looking for guidance on the software that they should be using, is that something you get involved in?

Jason Johnson

Yeah, yeah. Um, because I've worked with the practices so closely, I understand the need to move fast. Um, some of these practices, they have, you know, 9 to 13 rooms, and they've got to be cranking through these B&A photos. They don't have time to sit there and do certain things behind the camera, right? So, um, I've tried to suggest a handful of ideas that will speed that up, and some of those are in development now, and you guys have to wait to see that. But it will speed up the efficiency and accuracy that nobody else has touched on in the industry — nobody on the software side. So I'm really excited for those developments to come through, and the dev team's working on that right now.

Max Baybak

That's exciting. So it sounds like your partnership with, uh, TouchMD is a little bit more official than maybe some of the other platforms, when you've worked really in lockstep to build something that's very integrated with what they do.

Jason Johnson

Yeah, yeah, that was really intentional. Um, I had reached out in the past to a couple other, uh, software companies, and, um, just didn't really work out — um, the connection wasn't there. But when I reached out to TouchMD and Carrie Smith, the CEO, um, we hit it off. I love their software — it's intuitive, easy to use, and it does what you need to do, and it does it fast. And I always wanted to be able to complete the package, you know, my photo studio package, with software. And at the very least, I want to recommend — I want to have a very hot lead for somebody. I don't want to leave them with, um, hey, good luck looking for a software company, because that is exhausting, going through demos and hoping and wishing. So, um, it was really great to get this partnership going with them, and, uh, you know, we're just best friends — that's what it is. So our companies are best friends, right?

Max Baybak

I love that.

Jason Johnson

And we're helping each other out, and we're just, uh, elevating each other.

Max Baybak

Totally. It's a better experience for the client, for the end user, because rather than — you built them a perfect, amazing, custom-built photo booth, before and after photo booth — they don't have to pop out an SD card and then figure out what to do with it after that. Now, all of a sudden, by working closely with TouchMD, you have — it's already right there in the cloud immediately after taking it, right?

Jason Johnson

Yeah, yeah, immediately. It's — it's archived in their, uh, their album, and you can access it anywhere in the practice on any other iPad, so it's super easy to use.

Max Baybak

I can't tell you the difference between the iPhone as an integrated camera to — you know, and I know there are cloud-connected DSLRs and so forth — but just how much quicker you end up using those things on social media, because it's already there, yeah, connected to the cloud, yeah, versus I got to get it off a card. And just that small gap can change a lot, so being fully integrated makes a ton of sense. Yeah, I'm curious how you started, because I know you just mentioned — how have you been doing this with TouchMD, kind of that best friendship?

Jason Johnson

Um, yeah, about three years.

Max Baybak

Cool. Yeah, but you must have been doing this before — you said you were doing it and you wanted to find a software partnership. How did you kind of get into doing this in the first place, kind of consulting or building custom photo booths for, yeah, practices?

Jason Johnson

That, uh, that came in 2014, when I started working with Allergan launching Voluma. I was taking all their before and after photos for the, uh, the training sessions that Dr. Mauricio de Maio was putting on, and so I traveled with Mauricio and the Allergan team for two years, from 2014 to '16. We did 56 cities around the US, and in each city we would do between three to five days — sometimes one or two days if it was a quick one. Um, we would be taking six patients a day, and I would take their photos in the morning and then their afters in the afternoon.

Um, so that was the beginning of it, and that's when I was meeting the doctors. They would see my photos and they would take me aside — hey, Jason, do you think you can fly out and fix up my studio? Our photos are horrible. I said, well, yeah, I can build anything — I mean, I've got a background of developing products, and I love photography, so let's do it. So I'd fly out, set up the room, and then it was just one after another, word of mouth. So I've been doing this word of mouth for nine years or so, and it wasn't until, I don't know, maybe a year or two ago, I started thinking, okay, I need to turn this into a business, I think it's time. And I've just taken my time building it up, and then in, say, the last six months, I've really been ramping it up and making myself known in public to everybody.

Max Baybak

I know — I was gonna say, after nine years — we've been in the space a similar amount of time and I've never met — and this is always a pain point, not just the photos — a lot of the pain points that the software solves, but the original input and the consulting that people need. And like I said, we always try to help, but there's only so much we can do without it really being an in-depth process and custom building and, yeah, the right recommendations. Yeah, so I'm so glad we met. And that's super cool, uh, kind of how you got into it. I think it's worth telling us a little bit more about your background — you said you were traveling with Allergan, um, and you mentioned earlier doing media production and asset creation for pharma. What — yeah, can you tell us a little bit about your background there?

Jason Johnson

So, um, I think during the two years they started to see that I knew what I was doing, so I bumped off of that and started working, um, on some other video projects with them — uh, kind of light interviews, that sort of thing. Um, and then, once, uh, Kybella started to become a thing, then I went over and did a Kybella shoot — uh, I think it was 10 months, four patients, two up north in California and two in Pasadena, actually. Um, so I did that for quite a while, and that was an internal photo shoot — I wasn't, like — nobody saw those photos, I don't think. Um, although sometimes I've taken photos I didn't think were going to be published, and I see them in books that are in the offices and on, you know, ads and whatnot.

Um, so I did some Kybella, we did, uh, Botox and, uh, Juvéderm mix photos — we did those with models. Um, and, let me see — did some CoolSculpting before and after, and then moved on to Evolus — uh, what was that, 2018–19 — and, uh, went over to Evolus and shot all of their, um, all of their product photography and all of their model photography. So, um, I had to capture — all right, let me see if I get the numbers right — uh, nine models, 14 months. Um, so we started with the day zero, day three, seven, fourteen, thirty, and then we went every month on, and then we randomly brought on new, uh, models, but, uh, did that campaign shoot. So everything you see on their website and brochures, that's what I shot.

Um, and they also went over to Revance and started shooting for them. Um, we did a lot of work around the world, with, um — where I would manage the, uh, the production crews and help them with their photography and their videography. Um, yeah, so just lots of photo and video.

Max Baybak

That's really cool. Um, so these before and after photos that you're taking — these are kind of things that we would see, like, in a company's brand box assets that will go out to the practice once they become a customer of that brand? Is it that kind of thing, or —

Jason Johnson

Definitely the Evolus stuff, yeah, yeah — everything Evolus, uh, I shot all that. Um, but, like I say, in the lookbooks — you know, I remember I was at an office to set it up, and, uh, I was waiting in the waiting room, and I looked through one of the Allergan books, and I was like, oh, I shot them. That was not intended to be there, but, you know, they used it. It was because everything I shot, even on the Voluma tour over two years — it was fast, go, go, go, but I had my system down to where they were beautiful photos. I mean, they were awesome. And so they started using them in these lookbooks that they were handing out to the practices.

Max Baybak

That's cool — that's a cool story, kind of, and then how you wound up here seeing this need, yeah, for building these custom photo booths. You told me something right before we started rolling which I thought was interesting, and I loved — I didn't let you tell me the whole thing because I wanted to hear about it live here on the podcast. But you mentioned kind of a pivot you did with one of your carts during the pandemic. Will you tell us about that?

Jason Johnson

Yeah, yeah. So we had, uh — with Revance, we had a really big campaign that we were going to work on, and that was 121 shoot days, uh, in the year, and as you know, that's a big lift. So it was going to be me and my team traveling around the US doing the same trainings that we did — basically the same format, where it's one trainer training six doctors, they bring their own patient — and it was going to be documenting that and then doing video as well. Well, lockdowns happen, um, and that whole project got squished completely.

Well, my Shuttle Pro, that you saw, the carts — um, I quickly needed to pivot and still help my client out. I still wanted to help them train everybody, and I realized that we could do that simply by just running a Zoom call. So initially I thought, we can still — we can have the laptop and connect to the DSLR, but if we take it a step further and we put a PTZ camera, which is a pan-tilt-zoom camera, like one of those security cameras — we mount it to that, and then we can plug that into the laptop, and then we're set. So now we can Zoom with anybody, and we can capture anything.

So, to date, I think we have around 20, 21 of these units around the US, and they're training, um, full time. They're basically telemedicine devices — they are big telemedicine devices. So we've got top light, bottom light, camera in the middle, a confidence monitor so the doctor can see their shot, they can see who they're talking to, uh, wireless mic, and they're able to communicate and train people anywhere, anytime they want to. So we have some doctors that, you know, they'll do, like, say, eight trainings a month, and others, they'll do 50 a month, that sort of thing. So it's a way to reach out and get around the world.

Max Baybak

Yeah, I think that was a cool pivot in the pandemic — to go, hey, I have something that could be pretty quickly turned into a telemedicine device, which we all needed more than ever.

Jason Johnson

Yeah, we all needed telemedicine during that time. Yeah, that was — you know, everybody had to go video. You know, I had been using Zoom a little bit before that — that's why I was even aware of it. It was like, oh, we're using Zoom now for our meetings and all this stuff, and I thought, well, let's just do this and really just tap into telemedicine, but making a training device. So now these training devices are working really well.

Max Baybak

Smart. I never saw a faster shift in technological adoption than that, yeah. Because we used to try to do video calls with all of our surgeon clients, yeah, all the time, and it would be 10 minutes of kind of trying to figure it out — video is not working, I'm in the practice, we don't have a webcam on here, right, on these computers — yeah, okay, never mind, let's just do phone. And now, fast forward, it's like second nature, you know. Yeah, everybody has the equipment, everybody knows how to use it, everybody knows how to use Zoom now.

Yeah, so tying into that — this is — I'll leave you here, because I want to — I know it's been a long day here, and you'll probably — I'll be able to let you out and enjoy Miami. This is totally a little bit off subject, but since you've been in this industry for a long time, and we're talking about technological adoptions and changes, I'm curious to pick your brain on what you see coming when it comes to AI in media production. Yeah, and now, I know it's kind — okay, I'll preface this with: we have a media department, and actually we're creating a separate media company out of that. And our head of our media department, Jonathan, and I, and also my business partners, we talk a lot about how these things are coming to change. AI particularly is right up in the forefront right now, but there's some really fascinating things in audio processing — what is that Adobe's doing with AI, um, and in media production.

And I just kind of went on a deep dive myself recently to look at some of the technology that's out there. It's kind of staggering. You can clone people's voices. Um, there's programs like Descript that are doing crazy editing capability — I mean, there's so many of them that are using AI power. Particularly, I see it in the workflows and post-production, and then there's generative AI that eventually, they say — like, we're going to be able to — certain interviews and stuff I've read, you know, text-to-video, um, will come, and within 10 to 15 years, it'll be — you'll be able to, yeah, write text and have a Hollywood-level production created, yeah, from nothing but text. Although — yeah, I'll stop there and get your input, and I have more to say.

Jason Johnson

Well, I — yeah, you probably have way more on this than I do, because I just started to, I guess, accept this idea, right? It is an acceptance factor, and then start to look into it. And I actually told my son, I'm like, hey, will you please start looking into this, okay, for me? Yeah, just understand how much does it cost to use it — I don't even know how to use it, you know, or ChatGPT.

Max Baybak

I know, but you're technologically savvy, and you would get there. But it is acceptance, I believe that that's true — first you have to kind of bring the wall down.

Jason Johnson

Yeah, and that's it — it's the wall, because I have the wall up. It's like, man, do I really want to learn another technology? Yeah, you know, I've mastered Adobe, okay, I'm good — but do I really want to move on to that? And then it's just — it's accepting and then putting it in your workflow. But there — it seems like there's going to be some pretty amazing and scary things that are going to happen with it.

Max Baybak

Yeah, I think we're all — we've all thought, ah, how good could AI be, when we've been hearing rumors and tremblings of it for the last few years, and now I think we're all realizing, oh, it's gonna change things, yeah. Um, I'll share some things with you that I found. There's a founder of a company, did a podcast, and he's the one creating some of this technology, and he gave one interesting perspective that I'll share here, and then we'll leave it at that. Yeah, which is: if you go back a certain amount of years ago, it would have been unfathomable to think that you could create every instrument virtually, which you can now.

He said — like, on the side, he kind of hobbies — his hobby is, he's a music producer, DJ, right — this guy who's creating AI video, generative AI video. And he said, and now we can do that — I have every instrument packed in my computer, they're VSTs, virtual instruments. But we still play guitar, we still play piano, and we long for that kind of analog thing. Um, and that even when you'll be able to text the video that comes out with — of a Hollywood-level production, he said it's going to be its own class of media, and people will always still know — this is what he says — that it's not the same kind of media, right? It's just its own category of media. And it's similar to — people like EDM, dance music, but, they, you know, whatever, electronic music — but they're still going to want to listen to a great musician play an analog instrument.

Yeah, I think that's an interesting take. And I'll also say, as I analyze it in marketing, the need for video — uh, even if you could create it out of thin air, it doesn't really do much for a potential consumer who's looking at this video to vet this business and how authentic they are, if they know that it was generated by AI. So there's always going to be a need for media that's actually authentic.

Jason Johnson

I totally agree, and I had this conversation, uh, a couple days ago. It's like the transition that we went from film to digital cameras, and then digital cameras to iPhones, where us as photographers — and you probably went through this — is like, whoa, wait a second, everybody can take a beautiful photo with a phone, our jobs are done. But that wasn't the case, you know. Everybody kind of jumped to this conclusion that, like, our careers are at risk, but then we quickly realized, like, you have to understand all the fundamentals of photography and lighting and distance, composition, to effectively communicate what your client wants to see for a final product.

So I think you're spot on with the AI — is that you will see this signature AI look, and maybe that's a genre that people want to see, and they seek it out — oh, I want to see all the new AI movies that have been created this week. But when it comes to what we do, is producing, um, there's that human touch that will be on there that I don't think you can get from AI. I don't think — you know, we'll see where it goes.

Max Baybak

But even — even still, I think, even if — it will then become an ethical question of whether you're misleading people by not telling them that it's AI, and for marketing, you need — they need to know that it's the real deal, otherwise, what's the point?

Jason Johnson

You can — should it be watermarked?

Max Baybak

Yeah, well, that's a whole other thing — AI, yeah, yeah. And the subject of this, you know, authorship, right, is going to become really interesting, and, uh, there's so much to be said. But I think, short term, we're at — the subject of provenance, that's what I was looking for, is going to become really interesting, which is, you know, who is it created by, and, um, who owns it, and all of these things. It's going to get fascinating.

Jason Johnson

Totally. Digital rights management has always been kind of an interesting subject, and it's going to continue to really evolve rapidly.

Max Baybak

This week there were some crazy things with music — an AI-created song that was mimicking artists Drake and The Weeknd, and Google took it off YouTube because the record label — I forget which label it was — came in and said — and they used their voices to create it. We're gonna see a whole new world of trademarking and all that. In the short term, though, I think we can embrace the fact that it's actually going to do a lot in post-production workflows — that's what I know.

Jason Johnson

Yeah, and we might bark at that at first, but actually, in the end, like you said, there's so many things that have come before that have just made life easier, and at first it seems scary, but actually now we can't even imagine if we had to go tediously — what if we still, at the, you know — cut film, splice film. Yeah, you know what — you remember Napster, right?

Max Baybak

I do.

Jason Johnson

Napster came in and disrupted everything, yeah, and that's kind of the same thing. It's like, wait a second, you're making it sound like me, you know, and Drake — and making it — yeah, it actually is the same thing. It's piracy of another kind, it's piracy of another level, and then this is going to be an uproar, and everybody — hey, hold up, you can't go create and stuff that sounds like me.

Max Baybak

You're so right that it's really analogous to what happened — the uproar after Napster. Yeah, it's really just like that. Because these are — this is off the internet now. There was a few other people who posted on YouTube, reposted — I noticed those are gone too, so it's kind of quiet now. But this song, by the way, is good, and it's written entirely by AI. It's not just cloning their voice — it was written by AI: the beat, the lyrics, the rhyme, the rap, the voice, yeah.

Jason Johnson

Was that ChatGPT, was it?

Max Baybak

That's — I don't know the AI engine that did it, but I don't think so, because GPT is really focused right now just around — yeah, I don't know that there's a way to leverage ChatGPT's engine to make music and vocals and things like that.

Jason Johnson

That — nothing — well, I've heard the, uh, comedians — that you can write through ChatGPT. You can — uh, was it Joe Rogan — you can set it up for, uh, Louis CK, but with a Joe Rogan flair. Yeah, you can just twist and manipulate whatever you want, and then — and then he did an example of Mitch Hedberg. So they typed it in — do a Mitch Hedberg — which, he's passed on, and, uh, and the AI came up with the whole bit, and it sounded exactly like what Mitch Hedberg would have said.

Max Baybak

And this is — this is just the written word, or — it's actually — I think they typed in — they just typed in, make a bit that, uh, that Mitch — what we're seeing output is written words, or do they actually have a voice?

Jason Johnson

Sounded like him — it was everything, yeah, yeah.

Max Baybak

Three years, yeah. It's going to be interesting — it's gonna be — that's one thing we know for sure. Anyway, I just wanted to pick a random — as someone who's been doing this, clearly knows what they're doing, been at it a long time — I just thought I'd — we'd add that little segment on, so I appreciate it. But thank you so much for coming, and, yeah, I think sharing your story — really, really cool. And we're definitely going to be talking more about how we can connect you with some of our clients that need your services.

Jason Johnson

Yeah, love it.

Max Baybak

Okay. Thank you.